Author Topic: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?  (Read 2301 times)

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Brian

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #29 on: January 25, 2022, 03:14:57 AM »
I am in the "like" camp, have a good number of Mohr figures and sets but as yet not got to paint them, W.Otto has a close style and I have got these as well but I think it's  history that give the Mohr figures the edge.
But well done on getting the list together,  seen some figures I forgot I had, so a big thanks.

oleg

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #28 on: January 24, 2022, 02:13:31 PM »
Thanks Mark, for giving me the insight of another collector's view on flats. It looks like we are carefully observing the subject of our passion and share our thoughts and feelings with colleagues. I do appreciate this conversation and glad that I ignited it.
Oleg

marko

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #27 on: January 24, 2022, 02:02:50 PM »
Oleg

Your point of view was quite interesting to read and very fair.

I personally don't have an issue with his treatment of feet though I suspect maybe some of your issues are in the producer - many of my figures use a quite soft metal and longer weapons do bend easily (they can also be a pain to clean up.)

Your critique of his take on horses is more than fair, I do find they generally appear a bit undersized vs. war horses or steeds.  Also the Gypsy Camp and August der Starke going Hunting are a bit simplistic vs. his later output.

I do have a great fondness for the later work and I love his faces, humor and appreciation for simple life which I find appealing.  (The Broom Seller, the Knife Grinder, The Dentist...)

For me Mohr figures are a bit of a treat with my major objection being to the size of some of his sets - which for me would be a year or more of dedicated painting.

Though as you say we are spoiled by a wealth of really outstanding quality choices.  I do find painting a well designed/engraved figure much more pleasant than the alternative.

mark
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oleg

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #26 on: January 24, 2022, 01:45:25 PM »
Gentlemen,
thank you very much for your reaction on my post. Honestly I was not expecting any sort of support and your words just another sign for me how knowledgeable the people are in this Society with a great passion and understanding of flat figures. What you told me means that I am not alone in my search for better figures and creation a list of priorities.
Mohr deserve to be called a great muster but.... not the best. Simple like that.
Wish you happy collecting.
Oleg

Hannibal

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #25 on: January 24, 2022, 01:15:51 PM »
Very interesting disscussion, and thank you very much, Oleg, for your honnesty!  It is very useful as a foreigner, because I presume that Mohr is a national heroe inn Germany, as he produced series chich became very popular as Segom did with Napoleonic sets and middle ages, or some antiquity seriess.


It gives me a new insight for looking at these figures!
Of course the painter is also a key contributor, as he is on canvas painting and can either destroy or sublimate the engraving by his own art....
Michel
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Men are a bit like God: everything they can do, they do it. Or they will do it.  (Jean d'Ormesson)

archigrog

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #24 on: January 24, 2022, 12:46:21 PM »
Dear Oleg,


thank so much for your time in responding this not so simply request...I know!
After some years collecting figures (about from 1987...i was seventeen  ;D ), ...and becoming oldest ... i've started to have more attention on the single figure engraving: es. Mohr figures have usually a great face characterization ... but usually not so good legs or arms proportion or disposition. Face is the focus and not the entire figure.
After beeing a first love, Mohr figures have passed on a second position...i think you're right. Could depend on a four hands work (as if there was an artisan workshop behind him, the master engrave or draw only face and a follower completes the rest?) ?
Some Mohr figures seem to be like unfinished...but his drawings are very refined.


Claudio

oleg

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #23 on: January 24, 2022, 11:49:22 AM »
Well Claudio, it is a delicate subject because I know that many collectors admire Mohr's style and even name him the best engraver of flat figures.
My personal understanding of flat figure is that is a part of flat relief art and every figure I am judging from this point of view.
Great masters of the past like Frank, Maier, Thieme , Vasques  showed different approach to flat figure but were very professional in methods. The main ideas are: balance of ups and downs of the form, raising the edge of the contour to make it roll and give 3d effect etc. Scale balance is also very important. The figure itself is made in a scale and parts and details should be adopted to this scale which is not just simple diminishing the real figure 1:30, 1:40  ..... sculptors know very well that every scale has it's own set of form changes.
That is why artists and engravers of the past were searching for good ratios of foot to mounted figure. And they found it. Not many collectors nowadays really understand this heavy but very professional attitude in creating the figure.
So, why I don't like creations of Mohr:
- they are not finished. You may find a beautiful face or an arm together with crude feet without any shape and details
- not all of them well drawn and this is a surprise because he was a professional illustrator
- his grotesque figures are unnatural
- most of his horsed are poorly engraved and drawn and (to my understanding) has a bad rider/horse balance
- figure are poorly engraved from the technical point of view. Many parts are very thin and easy to break


I must say that when I first saw catalog sheets by WIMOR I was very excited. I was looking for these figures but after obtaining and painting few sets was totally disappointed.


Oleg

archigrog

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #22 on: January 24, 2022, 05:04:58 AM »
Gentlemen,
I found in my folders these two sheets of WIMOHR. Being not a fan of Mohr I admire the way sets were presented.
Hope it will be of interest. Could somebody post other sheets by WIMOHR here?
Thanks
Oleg


Please Oleg,
can you explain reasons why you are not a fan? I'm interested on different point of view. and this could be a new topic  ;D 


Claudio

marko

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2022, 10:51:16 AM »
Wimor sheets are here on the site under flat figure history:


http://www.intflatfigures.org/index.php?topic=1978.0


mark
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Hannibal

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2022, 10:19:23 AM »
Excellent idea ....


(note = recollecting data on Mohr, could be also done for Gottstein .....)
Michel
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Men are a bit like God: everything they can do, they do it. Or they will do it.  (Jean d'Ormesson)

oleg

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2022, 10:06:07 AM »
Gentlemen,
I found in my folders these two sheets of WIMOHR. Being not a fan of Mohr I admire the way sets were presented.
Hope it will be of interest. Could somebody post other sheets by WIMOHR here?
Thanks
Oleg

Hannibal

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2022, 04:18:40 PM »
Richard Taylor published last year a book on the flats issued by Mueller-Erfurt on the Middle Age.
This compendium is remarkable, complete, very well documented, I would even say "scientifically".
He is an excellent contact for understanding how he developped this book, and I won't be surprised to hear that is was probably le work of many years of search, patience and contacts on internet, but also in Germany, in the heart of the editors and collectors, in addition to his own provate gery and painted army....


Such book will keep its value only if in the future, the list of current editors is maintaed updated each time the moulds are moving around editors, cating organisatikons, musea and collectors, which requires a living communication system to update such information.  Otherwise the work is lost once it becomes impossible to find out where to obtain new casted mouls, those which definitively are destroyed or lost, and perhaps new flats npainted visible in their painted format..


As Mohr's works are already described in several books, it is important to constitute a similar database active and structured together with their author(s) and whoever wishes to do a similar job as Rick.


Redman, try also to catch Rick in one of his trips to Europe and to Germany, like this year to Kulmbach to have a discussion there with other German key contacts of Klio and German representatives, all présent during these unique days next August !!


Rick is on this site, and so are several other German key members . You can get such framework organized and see who will be interested.
Then it maight be interesting to see if other editors or engravors could be develkopped (Wolfgang Hafer, Oldhafer, Kieler, ....) as such spreading is going to continue as many of the contributors are quiet aged, and the risk of getting moulds being dumped in musea and inactive or private collectors increases with time.


It is the same as art paintings of old Masters escaping in private hands and disappearing from the public.


Klio and de Zinnfiguur seems to be amng the most important key partners, if not coordinators for such action, and perhaps BFFS can increase its cooperation and communiactions thruogh several of the international members closer than today with them in the future, if the leading embers of the site (BFFS) do accept to go in this direction.


The same question ecists woith larger size flats such those handled by Western Miniatures (not spread), Jupiter Miniatura, Schmalkalders ZF, ..; and the many others ...  Several of us have our own lists, none is completely updated, the list cheenges every months , we are going to disappear soon or later = how to maintain a global picture, and where ...


 
Michel
_______
Men are a bit like God: everything they can do, they do it. Or they will do it.  (Jean d'Ormesson)

redman

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2022, 06:46:05 AM »
Moderators:  Want to start a Sticky on Editor/Engraver databases and listings?   I do think it would be good to encourage this sort of activity.  If so, could you add my link (below) to the spreadsheet created for Mohr engravings / drawings.  Thanks.
I'd also like to share this with other major collectors's sites and publications eg ZF Leipzig, KLIO, Die Zinnfigur ............  Any suggestions as to what sites etc to approcah and perhaps also who the best interlocutor might be?  Open to ideas:  the database was quite a lot of work and I'd like to see it shared as widely as possible.

John Hoffmann

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2022, 06:31:57 PM »
Wow!
I don't think that I need to buy the best recommended book on F.K.Mohr.
All the information that I was after is right here on the forum(s).
Thanks to everyone who were generous with their time and resources for posting all the information here.
Stay well!
Thanks again,
John

redman

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Re: F.K.Mohr Books. Which One Is Best?
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2022, 01:05:26 PM »
I have opened up the link so that anyone can view and comment on it (but not edit it).
G