Author Topic: French knights in 1421  (Read 465 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Hannibal

  • Uploader
  • *
  • Country: be
Re: French knights in 1421
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2021, 03:17:51 PM »
Very nice !!


The is the French Kings' Oriflamme:


A little bit of history to understand: ...


The Oriflamme (from Latin aurea flamma, "golden flame") was the battle standard of the King of France in the Middle Ages. It was originally the sacred banner of the Abbey of St. Denis, a monastery near Paris. When the oriflamme was raised in battle by the French royalty during the Middle Ages, most notably during the Hundred Years War, no prisoners were to be taken until it was lowered. Through this tactic they hoped to strike fear into the hearts of the enemy, especially the nobles, who could usually expect to be taken alive for ransom during such military encounters.
In French, the term "oriflamme" has come to mean any banner with pointed ends, by association with the form of the original.
 
 Legendary origin
  The Oriflamme was mentioned in the eleventh-century ballad the Chanson de Roland as a royal banner, first called Romaine and then Montjoie. According to legend, Charlemagne carried it to the Holy Land in response to a prophecy regarding a knight possessing a golden lance, from which flames would burn and drive out the Saracens. This suggests that the lance was originally the important object, with the banner simply a decoration, but this changed over time.

The Oriflamme was first used by Louis VI in 1124 and was last flown in battle at Agincourt in 1415,  though a version of it remained in the Abbey of St. Denis until the 18th century.
Louis VI replaced the earlier banner of Saint Martin with the oriflamme of the Abbey of St. Denis (with the letters S.Denis) , which floated about the tomb of St. Denis and was said to have been given to the abbey by King Dagobert. Until the 12th century the standard-bearer was the Comte de Vexin, who, as vowed to St. Denis, was the temporal defender of the abbey. Louis VI, having acquired Vexin, became standard-bearer; as soon as war began, Louis VI received Communion at St. Denis and took the standard from the tomb of the saint to carry it into combat.

The Oriflamme was lost at least four times during its medieval history; Mons-en-Pévèle, Crécy, Poitiers, and during the campaigns of the Seventh Crusade under King Louis IX.

Although the Oriflamme has often been depicted as present at the battle of Agincourt, modern historians have disputed this. The banner was given to Guillaume de Martel by Charles VI on September 10, 1415, and carried by Martel from Paris to Rouen.  This was likely an attempt to raise French morale and rally troops, however there is no evidence that the Oriflamme was then taken on campaign and unfurled at Agincourt. Modern historians agree that the Oriflamme was not carried by Martel at Agincourt, as the king was not present at the battle in person.
 
 Appearance
  The banner was red or orange-red silk and flown from a gilded lance. According to legend, its colour stems from it being dipped in the blood of the recently beheaded St. Denis.
The surviving descriptions of the Oriflamme are in Guillaume le Breton (thirteenth century), in the "Chronicle of Flanders" (fourteenth century), in the "Registra Delphinalia" (1456) and in the inventory of the treasury of Saint-Denis (1536). They show that the primitive Oriflamme was succeeded in the course of the centuries by newer Oriflammes which bore little resemblance to one another except for their colour.
 
 Significance on the battlefield
  When the Oriflamme was displayed on the battlefield, it indicated that no quarter was to be given: its red colour being symbolic of cruelty and ferocity.
Although the azure ground (from the blue cope of St. Martin of Tours) strewn with gold fleur-de-lis remained the symbol of royalty until the 15th century, the Oriflamme became the royal battle standard of the King of France, and it was carried at the head of the king's forces when they met another army in battle. In the fifteenth century, the fleur-de-lis on the white flag of Joan of Arc became the new royal standard replacing both the symbol of royalty and the Oriflamme on the battle field.
 
 Porte oriflamme
  The bearer of the standard, the porte-oriflamme, became an office (like that of Marshal or Constable) and a great honour, as it was an important and very dangerous job to take charge of such a visible symbol in battle. If things went badly, the bearer was expected to die, rather than relinquish his charge.
Froissart vividly describes porte-oriflamme Geoffroi de Charny's fall at the side of his king at the Battle of Poitiers in this passage:
There Sir Geoffroi de Charny fought gallantly near the king (note: and his fourteen-year-old son). The whole press and cry of battle were upon him because he was carrying the king’s sovereign banner [the Oriflamme]. He also had before him his own banner, gules, three escutcheons argent. So many English and Gascons came around him from all sides that they cracked open the king’s battle formation and smashed it; there were so many English and Gascons that at least five of these men at arms attacked one [French] gentleman. Sir Geoffroi de Charny was killed with the banner of France in his hand, as other French banners fell to earth.
Notable Bearers of the Oriflamme
·       [/font]Geoffroi de Charny – 14th-century knight and author of several works on chivalry. He first bore the Oriflamme during the failed attempt to relieve Calais in 1347 and died at Poitiers defending it.
·       [/font]Arnoul d'Audrehem – 14th-century former Marshal of France. He held the office from 1368 to his death in 1370 but never carried the banner in action.
·       [/font]Guillaume de Martel – Seigneur de Bacqueville. He carried the Oriflamme at Agincourt and died there.
·       [/font]Sir Pierre de Villiers carried the Oriflamme at the Battle of Roosebeke against the Flemish rebels of Ghent led by Philip van Artvelde in 1382.






Therefore the knight of the figure could have been Geoffroi de Charny ...
Michel
_______
Men are a bit like God: everything they can do, they do it. Or they will do it.  (Jean d'Ormesson)

Christoph

  • Associate
  • Uploader
  • **
  • Country: de
Re: French knights in 1421
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2021, 10:25:26 AM »
Hello,
here´s a french banner to go with the knights.

The banner is taken from an late 15 century illumination showing the french army at Crecy. If you are interested have a look here:

http://warfare.gq/15/Froissart-Fr-2643-f165v-lg.htm


Christoph



Christoph

  • Associate
  • Uploader
  • **
  • Country: de
Re: French knights in 1421
« Reply #8 on: June 03, 2021, 03:23:52 AM »
Thank you,

The Battle of Bauge is an interesting part of the hundred years war. The english made some mistakes which let to their defeat, as Hannibal showed below.


Here some more.

Christoph





Christian

  • Uploader
  • *
  • Country: de
Re: French knights in 1421
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2021, 04:28:32 PM »
Nice Knights, well done!!


Bg Christian
Christian, Kettwig (Germany)
Privatoffizin Kettwiger Zinnfiguren / Kettwiger tin figures

John Alberts

  • Member
  • Uploader
  • ***
  • Country: us
Re: French knights in 1421
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2021, 12:57:38 PM »
Appreciate the history blurb as well.
JBA

Christoph

  • Associate
  • Uploader
  • **
  • Country: de
Re: French knights in 1421
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2021, 03:41:09 AM »
Thank you.
Here are some more.
Christoph


John Alberts

  • Member
  • Uploader
  • ***
  • Country: us
Re: French knights in1421
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2021, 02:01:30 PM »
The shading and highlighting of the caparison is really convincing.  Very nice color choice and subject; nice armor . . . a very well painted knight.  Wonderful to see.
JBA

Hannibal

  • Uploader
  • *
  • Country: be
Re: French knights in1421
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2021, 01:06:36 PM »
I love the painting, with a little bit more of colours !!


The battle of Baugé was a Scottish victory during the Hundred Years War, fought on French soil. By the start of 1419 the English under Henry V were in a very strong position in France. His victory at Agincourt had saved Henry’s invasion of France from ending in disaster, and had established him as a major force in France. Charles VI of France was increasingly insane, while his heir, the future Charles VII, was only sixteen, and had only become Dauphin in 1417, after the deaths of all four of his older brothers. The situation was further complicated by the ongoing civil war between the Royalist faction and the supporters of the dukes of Burgundy. This had seen John the Fearless, duke of Burgundy, order the murder of the king’s brother Louis of Orleans, while in 1419 supporters of the Dauphin would in turn murder the duke.
Late in 1418 the Dauphin Charles made an appeal for Scottish help. At this time Scotland was ruled by Robert Stewart, first duke of Albany (Just before the death of his father in 1406, the future James I had been sent to France, possibly to protect him from Albany, but on 22 March 1406 he had been captured at sea by the English, and in 1418 was still in captivity in England). Albany was generally in favour of the French alliance, and it was decided to send a force of 6,000 volunteers to France. The command was to be shared by Archibald Douglas, earl of Wigtown (or Wigtoun), the son of the fourth earl of Douglas, and Albany’s second son John Steward, third earl of Buchan. A fleet of ships from Castile reached Scotland in September 1419, and on 29 October 1419 the Scottish army reached the Dauphin’s court at Bourges.
As is often the case with well documented medieval battles, the more sources we have the less certain we can be about the course of the battle. To make things more complex in this case we have four different sets of chronicles – Scottish, French, English and Burgundian – none of which are entirely internally consistent - as an example the two main Scottish sources (the Liber Pluscardensis and the Scotichronicon) disagree on the size of the Scottish army and on who killed Clarence, while the Lancastrian dynasty was not universally popular in England.
The Franco-Scottish Army
It is impossible to be sure of the exact numbers of men in either of the armies present at Baugé. Estimates of the size of the Franco-Scottish army vary least, ranging from 5,000 to 7,000, with 6,000 most likely.
The Scots made up by far the largest part of this army, although exactly how many Scots were present is again unclear. The Scottish army that reached France in 1419 was almost certainly 6,000 strong, but this force had not been kept together. Some of the Scottish troops were used to reinforce Dauphinist garrisons upstream of Paris and in Maine and Anjou (during 1420 Henry V had encountered Scottish troops during the siege of Melun). However we also know that Buchan and Wigtown had returned to Scotland during 1420 to recruit more men, returning in January 1421. The majority of sources agree that the Scots made up by far the largest part of the Franco-Scottish army, while Buchan and Wigtown commanded the combined force.
The small French contribution to the combined army was led by the Constable of La Fayette, one of the dauphin’s marshals. It was probably a force of local levies, although would have contained a core of more experienced men associated with La Fayette. There was also a small force of Angevins under the lord of Fontaines, who had joined the army just before the battle (the lord of Fontaines would be amongst the small number of French casualties at the end of the battle). Despite this the army was overwhelmingly Scottish.
In the time between their arrival in 1419 and the battle the Scots had gained a rather poor reputation amongst the French – both main Scottish sources report that they were seen as “consumers of mutton and wine” – but they still had a high reputation with the Dauphin. 
The English Army
The size of the English army is much less certain. A number of sources give figures for the size of the army at the start of the expedition. The Scottish Liber Pluscardensis gives a figure of 10,000 men, which French sources give figures that range from 4,000 up to 12,000. The French chronicle of Juvénal may be most accurate, giving Clarence around 6,000-7,000 men at the start of his expedition, including 1,200 nobles, who would have made up the bulk of the men actually involved in the battle.
The army was commanded by Henry’s oldest brother Thomas of Lancaster, duke of Clarence. In March 1421 he was the heir to the throne (Henry’s new wife, Catherine of Valois may have been pregnant by this point, but the future Henry VI would not be born until early December, so it is probably safe to assume that this was not yet known).
Whatever the actual size of the English army, all accounts agree that only a small part of it actually took part in the battle – the men-at-arms led by Clarence, while Salisbury was left behind to gather together the archers. In English armies of this period the ratio of archers to men-at-arms was at least 3-1, and so Clarence many have gone into battle with no more than a quarter of his army.
It is generally accepted that Clarence fought with around 1,500 men-at-arms at Baugé – English sources suggest that few of the men-at-arms escaped, while the Scotichronicon gives a total of 1,617 English dead, roughly in line with other sources. Given a ratio of 3-1 this would have given him 4,500 archers, for a total of 6,000 men.

The Raid
Clarence’s army mustered at Bernay in March 1421. His target was Angers, on the Loire. He is said to have believed that the Franco-Scottish army was somewhere in this vicinity. His army moved fast, crossing the River Huisne at Pont-de-Gennes, just to the east of Le Mans, and then turning to the south west, crossing the Loir at Luché (between La Flèche and Le Lude). When Clarence reached Angers the town was too strongly defended for him to besiege, and so he retreated east to Beaufort-en-Vallée, to the east of the town. At the same time the Scottish force was moving west from Tours, and would soon be in place to the north of the English, blocking the direct route back to Normandy.
The Battle
On the night before the battle the two armies were only eight miles apart. During Good Friday (21 March) the Franco-Scottish army had reached Le Lude, on the Loir, eleven miles to the north east of Baugé. They had then moved on to Baugé, before finally moving about one mile further to the south west to the small village of Vieil Baugé. At this point Clarence was based at Beaufort en Valleé, eight miles further to the south west. The two armies were also separated by the River Couasnon, which runs south west from Baugé, passing to the east of Vieil Baugé but to the west of Beaufort. The only available bridge across the river was at Baugé.
By the morning of 22 March at the latest Buchan and Wigtown had decided to offer battle at La Lande Chasles, a small village six miles to the south east of Baugé, on the opposite side of the Couasnon. The evidence suggests that they knew that Clarence was close by, but that Clarence was unaware how close he was to the Scottish army. That morning Buchan sent La Fayette to inspect the ground at La Lande Chasles, while Clarence sent foraging parties out in every direction (these foraging parties contained most of his archers).
One of those foraging parties, possibly under Sir Gilbert Umfraville, was sent north towards Baugé, and at some point during the morning discovered the present of the Franco-Scottish army, capturing a number of Scots. They then returned to Beaufort, where Clarence questioned them (possibly while at dinner).
This was almost certainly the first Clarence learnt of the Scottish presence, and he now made the mistake that would lead directly to his defeat and death. Rather than wait for the foraging parties to return to Beaufort, Clarence decided to attack the Scots with his mounted men-at-arms. The earl of Salisbury was left behind to gather together the rest of the army and bring them north as quickly as possible.
Early in the afternoon of 22 March Clarence, at the head of around 1,500 men-at-arms, including the earls of Somerset and Huntingdon, Edmund Beaufort, John Grey count of Tancarville and Lords Roos and Fitzwalter, rode out of Beaufort heading for the bridge at Baugé. The main reason for this disastrous decision would appear to be that Clarence wanted to win some glory for himself. He had not been present at Agincourt, and was not temperamentally suited for the war of sieges that had followed. Huntingdon and Umfraville were both said to have attempted to persuade him to wait for the rest of the army, but without success.
At this point the Franco-Scottish army was dangerously scattered. La Fayette and his scouts were on the same side of the river as Clarence. Most of the men were at Vieil Baugé, south west of the bridge, and according to the Scottish sources were either at prayers or playing sports. Near the bridge were thirty men under Robert Stewart of Railstone, while another hundred under Walter Kennedy were quartered in a nearby church.
La Fayette’s scouts were first to spot the approaching English army, raising the alarm. Exactly where the first clash took place is not entirely clear, but it was probably around the bridge at Baugé. The main Scottish sources report that Clarence was initially unable to force his way across the bridge in the face of a storm of Scottish arrows, but was eventually able to make his way across, either using the bridge, or across a swampy ford.
Having abandoned his archers at Beaufort, Clarence should at least have made sure that his force of men-at-arms kept together. Instead he had allowed it to become stretched out on the road to Baugé. He was now in a very dangerous situation. His own small force was divided by the river. The Scots had been alerted to his presence, and the small force at the bridge had delayed the English for long enough for Buchan to gather together a large part of his own army.
French sources report a short clash between the English and a small French force under Jean de la Croix at this point, which ended when the French retreated into the parish church. A clash with a small force of cavalry is mentioned in at least one English source, which may reflect this same incident.
Even now Clarence does not seem to have waited for all of his men-at-arms, but instead to have advanced towards the main Scottish force at Vieil Baugé. Scottish and French sources both state that some of the English troops arrived late, after having been left behind on the ride to Baugé.
Vieil Baugé lies on a low ridge a short distance back from the river. At this point the main Scottish force would appear to have been hidden over the skyline, and Clarence began to advance up the slope towards the village (Scottish, English and French sources). At some point during this climb, Buchan led his men over the skyline and the two armies charged.
The result was a confused hand-to-hand melee, in which the outnumbered English was virtually wiped out. Clarence was one of the first to be killed. Hardly surprisingly none of the sources agree on how he died or who killed him. Amongst the possible candidates are Alexander Makcaustelayn (a Lennox highlander), the lord of Fontaines (in single combat between the armies before the battle!), Charles le Bouteiller and William de Swinton (a mistake for John Swinton, Buchan’s nephew). The Liber Pluscardensis is more honest, suggesting that it was impossible to tell who had killed whom in the melee, while Walsingham claimed that the death of Clarence did not become known until some time after the battle, when the bodies of the slain were searched.
Notable English casualties included the count of Tancarville, Lord Roos and Gilbert Umfraville. The earls of Huntingdon and Somerset, Edmund Beaufort and Lord Fitzwalter were amongst the prisoners. Very few of the English men-at-arms escaped from the melee.
Casualties
Overall the English probably lost around 1,500 men. The Scotichronicon gives a figure of 1,617 dead. French sources tend to support the figure of 1,500 casualties, either mostly dead, or a mix of dead and captured.
Scottish and French losses were much lower. The two main Scottish sources provide very low figures – the Liber Pluscardensis gives suggest eighteen killed, while the Scotichronicon reported the dead as twelve Scots and two Frenchmen. As with some English reports from Agincourt, these figures are almost certainly too low, especially for a close quarters melee battle, but even if we multiply them by ten it is clear that the Scots had won a very cheep victory.
« Last Edit: June 03, 2021, 04:32:28 AM by Hannibal »
Michel
_______
Men are a bit like God: everything they can do, they do it. Or they will do it.  (Jean d'Ormesson)

marko

  • Administrator
  • Uploader
  • *****
  • Country: us
Re: French knights in1421
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2021, 10:33:04 AM »
This a great start, stunning knight!


Mark  8)
Site Admin

Christoph

  • Associate
  • Uploader
  • **
  • Country: de
French knights in 1421
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2021, 10:20:41 AM »
Hello,
here is the first of a groupe of french knights I´m painting at the moment.
Christoph

« Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 03:42:20 AM by Christoph »

 

Powered by EzPortal